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Question About Steve's Real Food Study About High-Pressure Processing on Raw Meat Diets

Dr. Christina

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@Dr. Jean Hofve @Dr. Jeff @Dr. Barbara
Dr. Jeff and I were discussing this after my return from the AHVMA conference. he has had reports from people that their animals (i forget if cats or dogs) were less vital eating HPP treated foods.

there has been changes in the recommendation sin the last few years, so a person I respect in the food industry strongly feels it is now OK. The above study does not (because few will fund anecdotal studies) compare the BEAM of animals eating HPP and non-HPP food. I am still concerned about the plastic leaching issue and would not recommend feeding just an HPP food. Again, Dr. Jeff leans away from HPP.

For me, the answer is not clear yet. Of course, we strongly recommend feeding a variety of foods, frozen, homemade, raw, cooked, etc, so if some of it were HPP it would not be significant. I would do a test - keep feeding your regular food and add in Steve's for a few weeks or more and carefully monitor BEAM and Early Warning Signs of Internal Imbalance to see if there are changes. Do post your results if you do this.

Dr. Christina

Dr. Christina
 

Dr. Jeff

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It's a nice article and study.

However, as Dr. Christina mentioned, vitality, cellular energy and mitochondrial function is not studied.

Until it is, I'll stick with non HPP foods like Small Batch and Viva (which has a 25% discount on the first order for HA! members).
 

Dr. Jean Hofve

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I agree, non-HPP is better, it is being implemented as a defense against the FDA and its vendetta against raw diets.

Also, remember that our friend Steve sold Steve's Real Food long ago (he actually worked for Natural Balance for a while), so we shouldn't attribute this study to him.
 

ChristineL

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It's a nice article and study.

However, as Dr. Christina mentioned, vitality, cellular energy and mitochondrial function is not studied.

Until it is, I'll stick with non HPP foods like Small Batch and Viva (which has a 25% discount on the first order for HA! members).
Hi Dr. Jeff - Have you ordered from Viva Raw?
 

Dr. Jeff

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Yup!

Archie's been eating Viva for a few months now (thank you Christine for guiding us to it!).
 

LilF

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I agree, non-HPP is better, it is being implemented as a defense against the FDA and its vendetta against raw diets.

Also, remember that our friend Steve sold Steve's Real Food long ago (he actually worked for Natural Balance for a while), so we shouldn't attribute this study to him.
So if Steve sold it, is the quality the same..... The "expert" in my pet food store still highly recommends Steve's... I just bought another bag of beef and turkey---From the article below. So what are packaging compounds and what can we expect our dog to be eating. This is not clear. So I take it Viva does not have migration of packaging compounds and has a study been done or is Steve's vilified because there is a study but all other brands have it too. Or is it only with HPP foods like Steve's.
A 2009 study showed the migration of packaging compounds into high‐pressure‐treated beef and chicken breast packed in multilayer polymeric bags.
 

Dr. Jean Hofve

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I don't know. He sold it a very long time ago, and t's still privately owned, and claimed to be the same. I have no independent knowledge whether that is the case. I hope so!
 

LilF

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Hi Dr. Jeff - Have you ordered from Viva Raw?
Where can we find a list of non HPP foods. What about Primal? I fed that forever with my other dogs. I have also been using Open Farm gently cooked. Nobody ever did a study on how much of that plastic packaging is in the food... I would do a completely home made diet----but worry about balancing and have not liked the vitamin supplement to add (I used Dr. Becker's and my dog got diarrhea both times I used it and it turned the food white
 

Dr. Jeff

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Where can we find a list of non HPP foods. What about Primal?
Great question Lil! I'm not aware of any that are up to date (Will Falconer had one in the past).

I think that Primal poultry "flavors" are HPP but I'm not sure of the others.

Perhaps compiling a list is something you'd like to do (by asking the companies)!
 

LilF

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Great question Lil! I'm not aware of any that are up to date (Will Falconer had one in the past).

I think that Primal poultry "flavors" are HPP but I'm not sure of the others.

Perhaps compiling a list is something you'd like to do (by asking the companies)!
Nah.... but thanks for the vote of confidence!! I did suggest to my vet when I educated him on spay/neuter alternatives here and in Europe, and presented him all the research, that he should do a longitudinal study on his own long time practice of what dogs were desexed versus intact or left hormonally intact and evaluate longevity, disease, age of onset etc..... but short of that, me thinks my next long term project is to train Blossom to let people in the house! Actually now I am remembering I do think Susan Thixton indicates this on her yearly list which I have not purchased yet because I did not think I would be getting another dog. But I do have the old list that is about 3 years old
 

LilF

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I was wondering if purchasing the Steve's patties in the box would prevent the transfer of packaging chemicals to the food? I just bought 2 bags before reading all this. Maybe I will return them.
 

Dr. Jeff

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Maybe, but you can also just switch foods after this box is done.
 

LilF

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It's a nice article and study.

However, as Dr. Christina mentioned, vitality, cellular energy and mitochondrial function is not studied.

Until it is, I'll stick with non HPP foods like Small Batch and Viva (which has a 25% discount on the first order for HA! members).
I switched to Vital Essentials for a while and at the same time continued to feed "some" Open Farm gently cooked. She developed diarrhea and not sure from which food---maybe both. I highly suspect the Open Farm. I have talked to some of the more knowledgeable people at the pet food store and they said Open Farm changed the consistency--it seems like soup if you heat it in the pan to warm it up. Just a couple months ago I was using the old formula (consistency---I understand the formula did not change--only the consistency). I used the old formula to mold her pills for her pyometra in and it was beautiful---then the box and consistency changed and she gets diarrhea. I returned the food (beef and turkey). One person at the pet food store was feeding Open Farm for his dog with cancer for over 2 years and now he doesn't like it. Ditto for another worker there who doesn't like it. One of the workers was told that they changed the consistency to appease kibble feeders as it was too expensive to feed as a stand alone meal so they satisfied the topper people and the food is really objectionable unless you have a dog with no teeth or taste buds. So I am back to Steve's. Likewise the Vital Essentials was ok for Blossom months ago but now they changed the bag (I was told when they change the bad they often change the food). So that food doesn't work either. As i told a company who shipped me some organic coffee that tasted terrible. I told them I prefer toxic coffee because theirs tasted terrible. Likewise if Blossom has a normal stool with toxic food (HPP) then she will get toxic food. I don't really think Steve's is toxic as the guy who works at the pet store has spent thousands on his dog's allergy testing and seems to be well educated...he feeds his dog Steve's too. Luckily I was able to return all the food, Vital Essentials and Steve's. Will try Small Batch but dogs in the past turned up their nose to it. I feel sad Open Farm ruined their good food. I fed it to Gabby (now Deceased 2 years) when she had the PLE and we got her albumin back to normal with Open Farm.
 

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