After 2 month of non bacterial UTI treatment high specific gravity and struvites formation are not resolved.

[ElenaD]

Hello All,

In March My 2 yo intact male Havanese was diagnosed with non bacterial UTI ( blood in the urine, protein 3+, struvites 4-10), squamous epithelia , ph 7, specific gravity 1,05)
He was treated originally with VetClassic
Urinary Tract for 3 weeks and then Adored Beast Easy Peesy Protocol for 4 weeks.
Urine test recheck shows UTI resolved exept Specific Gravity increased to 1,065 and Struvites still present at 4-10level. pH 6.5.

My dog is also on Phyto Synergy, positive Immunity, Potent Sea Omega, Digest by Four Leaf Rover. I stoped Love Bugs for now while giving him Gut Soothe to take care of some digestion issue. ( morning vomit, eating a lot of grass and loss of appetite). After 3 days of Gut Soothe he was back to normal though I continued the remedy for another 4 days.
Previously he was on Wolf, Fido’s Flora.

Darragh is raw fed , mainly on Steve’s and Green JuJu protein, with addition of a few teaspoons of Green JuJu frozen veggies blend, goat milk plus the 1 chicken neck in the morning and evening. His treats are usually freeze dry.

My opinion he is not drinking enough water, but he is on raw diet and I’m adding filtered water to his food bowl with each feeding.

His BEAM looks fine to me. He is a happy fellow though

Do you think the cause of the concentrated urine and crystal formation is not enough water intake or the diet imbalance or the kidney deficiencies ?
Urine Protein/creatinine ratio is normal

How to get to the root cause of this issue? Should I continue Easy Peesy protocol ? Could it be that adding more veggies (Green JuJu blends) changes the mineral balance of his food intake as well as urine pH making it more alkaline ( though 6.5 in neutral). I’m worried

Thank you.

 

[Dr. Jeff]

not drinking enough water

I agree.

Do you think the cause of the concentrated urine and crystal formation is not enough water intake or the diet imbalance or the kidney deficiencies ?

Yes (insufficient water), no (diet) yes to energetic imbalance.

How to get to the root cause of this issue?

Ah, perfect question! Veterinary homeopathy, acupuncture/TCVM, and other energy balancing methods. Homeopathy is the most effective way to treat the root IMO.

Easy Peesy protocol

Easy peesy II is great support. E.P. I is a combination homeopathic medicine that may help symptoms but won't necessarily address the root or decrease his long-term susceptibility (or decrease his chances of getting sick in the future).

Perhaps add structured water, and start (or continue) working with a vet homeopath.

Structured water synopsis

Some of us have been engaging in a discussion about structured water and products to produce it. It has been suggested that we share that discussion and welcome you all to ask or provide more info. These are excerpted from our posts: Francine: After listening to Dr. Seigel's presentation, I...

www.holisticactions.com

Try not to worry. His body is designed to rebalance as long as you support his body and remove any obstacles to cure (which you're already doing).

 

[NancyK]

Hello All,

In March My 2 yo intact male Havanese was diagnosed with non bacterial UTI ( blood in the urine, protein 3+, struvites 4-10), squamous epithelia , ph 7, specific gravity 1,05)
He was treated originally with VetClassic
Urinary Tract for 3 weeks and then Adored Beast Easy Peesy Protocol for 4 weeks.
Urine test recheck shows UTI resolved exept Specific Gravity increased to 1,065 and Struvites still present at 4-10level. pH 6.5.

My dog is also on Phyto Synergy, positive Immunity, Potent Sea Omega, Digest by Four Leaf Rover. I stoped Love Bugs for now while giving him Gut Soothe to take care of some digestion issue. ( morning vomit, eating a lot of grass and loss of appetite). After 3 days of Gut Soothe he was back to normal though I continued the remedy for another 4 days.
Previously he was on Wolf, Fido’s Flora.

Darragh is raw fed , mainly on Steve’s and Green JuJu protein, with addition of a few teaspoons of Green JuJu frozen veggies blend, goat milk plus the 1 chicken neck in the morning and evening. His treats are usually freeze dry.

My opinion he is not drinking enough water, but he is on raw diet and I’m adding filtered water to his food bowl with each feeding.

His BEAM looks fine to me. He is a happy fellow though

Do you think the cause of the concentrated urine and crystal formation is not enough water intake or the diet imbalance or the kidney deficiencies ?
Urine Protein/creatinine ratio is normal

How to get to the root cause of this issue? Should I continue Easy Peesy protocol ? Could it be that adding more veggies (Green JuJu blends) changes the mineral balance of his food intake as well as urine pH making it more alkaline ( though 6.5 in neutral). I’m worried

Thank you.

Am I correct in understanding that you are feeding two chicken necks per day in addition to balanced foods from Steve's and Green JuJu that contain raw meaty bones? This sounds like an excessive amount of RMBs. While I believe raw meaty bones are a critical part of the diet, I think moderation is key and it is important to consider the diet as a whole. I can tell you from first hand experience with feeding my two dogs, feeding excessive amounts of raw meaty bones can cause digestive upset and loss of appetite. I also wonder if the excessive feeding of necks every day could contribute to struvite stones. The most important thing I have learned from 15 years of DIY raw feeding of two dogs. Overdoing anything will cause problems.

Nancy

 

[ElenaD]

Thank you Dr. Jeff. I will take a looks at the structural water. I have a holistic vet who uses a lot of different modalities including homeopathy.

Nancy, thank you for your concern and advice. Darragh is 14.5 lbs. I alternate
Steve’s and Green JUJu, mainly beef. I tried duck and goat but he ate it without any enthusiasm, often skipping the meal picking up just his chicken neck..
This is his fresh favorite food. I’m getting necks from the local farmer who raises his chickens on the pasture.
His bowl usually is 75% of Steve’s or GJ beef daily feeding recommended by the brand and 1 chicken neck. He has never developed soft stool on this combination I’m adding GJ veggies and a raw goat milk in about 2 teaspoons If I ‘overdose’ the veggies he is producing a very soft stool.

I asked once my holistic vet about Darragh’s diet and he has never expressed any concern related to the amount of the meaty bones I am feeding Darragh. But I think you have a point. I will try to limit the amount of chicken necks and retest him in a month.

Also do you think it will be beneficial to switch or alternate his proteins. I have never fed him a strictly chicken diet. In general the chicken considered to be a lower phosphorus protein than beef. Any thoughts?

Many thanks.

 

[NancyK]

Thank you Dr. Jeff. I will take a looks at the structural water. I have a holistic vet who uses a lot of different modalities including homeopathy.

Nancy, thank you for your concern and advice. Darragh is 14.5 lbs. I alternate
Steve’s and Green JUJu, mainly beef. I tried duck and goat but he ate it without any enthusiasm, often skipping the meal picking up just his chicken neck..
This is his fresh favorite food. I’m getting necks from the local farmer who raises his chickens on the pasture.
His bowl usually is 75% of Steve’s or GJ beef daily feeding recommended by the brand and 1 chicken neck. He has never developed soft stool on this combination I’m adding GJ veggies and a raw goat milk in about 2 teaspoons If I ‘overdose’ the veggies he is producing a very soft stool.

I asked once my holistic vet about Darragh’s diet and he has never expressed any concern related to the amount of the meaty bones I am feeding Darragh. But I think you have a point. I will try to limit the amount of chicken necks and retest him in a month.

Also do you think it will be beneficial to switch or alternate his proteins. I have never fed him a strictly chicken diet. In general the chicken considered to be a lower phosphorus protein than beef. Any thoughts?

Many thanks.

Typically if excessive raw meaty bones are fed, the stools become hard or pellet like. So you may be doing fine with feeding 75 percent of the commercial with a chicken neck. However, sometimes veggies can sort of muddy the waters by changing the stool consistency and adding supplements could change it too. Then it becomes harder to isolate just how the bone affects the diet. My one dog shows more digestive upset than the other if I feed too much bone. I think they are all different in how much they do well on. It just caught my eye feeding two necks per day along with the regular diet.

I know most people encourage lots of different proteins, however I personally feel quality is what is most important. So to me chicken is not going to hold a candle to grass fed beef for example. I use chicken for raw meaty bones so tend to go mainly with grassfed beef for their main protein because I feel they get enough chicken. I do think some variety is good if the dog shows interest but I don’t push it. I go with the quality proteins I can source.

The one thing I do know is that both Green JuJu and Steve's beef and lamb formulas are very high in copper. This is because they tend to use lots of organ meats, particularly liver and liver from ruminant animals is extremely high in copper. Therefore, if you can rotate the ruminant formulas with other formulas like poultry or pork you will reduce the chances of too much copper accumulating over time. Steve's Lamu formula is particularly high in copper. You may want to research about excessive copper in dog food. Liver is just another example of how overdoing something (even if good) can cause problems.

Good luck with your little one. Sounds like he is in great hands.

Nancy

 

[Dr. Jeff]

I asked once my holistic vet about Darragh’s diet and he has never expressed any concern related to the amount of the meaty bones

I agree.

Yes, variety is key (freshness, variety and moderation).

 

[Dr. Jean Hofve]

Plants absolutely raise urine pH. A cow's urine is pH 8, a cat pH 5. More meat and less veggies in the diet will lower pH and increase thirst because of its mild diuretic effect. I agree that 2 chicken necks is a lot for a small dog. Meat without the bone may work better to help regain balance. Excess calcium won't cause struvite but *could* cause calcium oxalate crystals which are a much bigger problem. Struvite will dissolve on its own once the pH goes down.

 

[NancyK]

One option would be to make your own dog food using the necks as part of a balanced diet. You could just add meat and organs, in moderation, occasional egg and fish. This way you could avoid the veggies that companies put in their food as well as the excessive amount of organ meats. I am sorry but Green JuJu uses no muscle meat in their formulas. They use huge amounts of heart instead and who knows how much other organs are used. I believe organs are important but too much over time can cause issues, even excessive heart. You could also consider using chicken wings in rotation with necks for more variety. Small dogs don't have as many RMB options but i would rotate at least with wings instead of overfeeding necks.These companies use excessive organs because they are cheap. I personally rotate organs and do not believe in feeding the same ones every single day.

Nancy

 

[Dr. Jeff]

Thanks for the great suggestions Dr. Jean and Nancy!

 

[NancyK]

Just wanted to add that I have not fed a single veggie to my dogs in over 15 years. They are 16 and 17 and still doing great. Therefore, in my experience with two dogs of different breeds there is no need to fear leaving veggies out at least temporarily to assess if it helps. You could always add small amounts back later if you want.

Mine do not do well on veggies so I don't feed them. In fact, one reason I went to homemade was to avoid them. I also wanted control over the other ingredients and avoid feeding excessive organ meats, particularly liver which is very high in vitamin A and copper.

Nancy

 

[Dr. Jeff]

Thanks for sharing your personal experiences Nancy!

Having 16 and 17 year young pups is a testament to your conscious and compassionate care.

 

[NancyK]

Thanks for sharing your personal experiences Nancy!

Having 16 and 17 year young pups is a testament to your conscious and compassionate care.

Thanks Dr. Jeff!

These are my first dogs ever and I made many mistakes, however I knew that real fresh food is critical for their health and I did not trust anyone to make it but me. Therefore, this has been top priority for me and I have fed them a homemade raw diet most of their lives. It has been frustrating at times because many well meaning people and vets tried to discourage me and tell me I was harming my dogs. I persisted in spite of this and am now blessed with two very old dogs who are still in great health.

I am sure their diet has not been perfect, especially at the beginning, however I have gotten better with experience. The good news is that dogs are resilient and I don't believe "perfect" diets are necessary for them to thrive. There are a few basics of course but that's it.

Nancy

 

[Dr. Jeff]

Good for you (and your dogs) for persevering!!

If you’re comfortable sharing, I’d love to hear more about how you were able to go beyond the vet’s, and other people’s, good intentions and advice?

 

[NancyK]

Good for you (and your dogs) for persevering!!

If you’re comfortable sharing, I’d love to hear more about how you were able to go beyond the vet’s, and other people’s, good intentions and advice?

When I got my dogs they were my first dogs and I was clueless. I did everything back then I now shudder to think about. Vaccines, kibble, heartworm drugs, flea preventatives, etc. I would look at my dogs eating their dry pellets and thought this just cannot be right. Dogs need REAL food, just like humans! I wanted to do something different but had no clue where to begin. This was 17 years ago long before there was much information out there about raw feeding. I found out about Ian Billinghurst and read his book Give Your Dog a Bone. I got brave and started feeding some chicken wings. Wow, they went nuts!!! When I saw how much they loved this I knew I had to switch from kibble to raw. I luckily found a yahoo group of natural rearing breeders who have fed raw homemade for decades. They helped guide me on the basics of feeding homemade raw. I also stopped all vaccines, heartworm drugs, and flea preventatives.

When friends or family found that I fed raw, some of them tried to discourage me. One dear friend in particular sent me tons of articles about how I was going to make myself sick and my dogs sick, etc. She was very well meaning and I would read the articles but just stick to my guns and what I felt in my gut was right. She also went to vets at University of Missouri vet school and she would get tons of information from them on the evils of raw dog food and she would send it to me, along with recommendations on feeding a "high quality" diet like Hill's. They also recommended continuing to vaccinate regularly and one vet told her every additional vaccine further boosts immunity. These are supposed "top" vets at a big veterinary school.

As far as vets, one experience stands out to me that makes me leary of letting vets know I feed a raw homemade diet. Early on when my yorkie was very young, he went crazy during one of the big cicada years and was eating their skeletons like crazy! I think this made him sick. This was also one of my early lessons on how overdoing anything can be a problem. Anyway, I took him to the vet. Once she found out I fed homemade raw, she immediately blamed that and looked no further. i said ai wondered if it could be the cicada eating and she said no way eating bugs would do that. This was scary because it shows how the root cause of something can be overlooked if vets immediately blame diet and do not look further. Anyway, after a few days of slippery elm he was fine. Since then I try to avoid discussing diet with vets until I can get a feel for their food views.

My dogs are still doing great but sleep more nowadays. Yet every day at 5 pm we play a game where they search all over the house for treats. They love this game and it is the highlight of their day. They both act like puppies again. It is great nose work and provides some exercise. The yorkie was a great hunter in his prime and killed many moles. What is funny is that my other dog (Havanese/Papillon) stood by and would watch him. At age 11, she decided to try her hand at it and wow...what a thrill...she caught her first mole. I swear that moment was the highlight of her entire life. She was so proud of herself!

Nancy

 

[GinnyW]

Boy, Nancy; that sounds so much like us! My first dog, born in 1995, was subjected to shots by his breeder, and then my vet, recommended by a friend, started the protocol all over again. He developed orthopedic issues - poor hip development, two cruciate tears, etc. and allergic symptoms, temperament issues, etc. Having heard of raw, I took the plunge and handed him a chicken wing, thinking I had just killed my dog. On from there I became a "mover and shaker" in the northern CA raw movement, and discovered the power of homeopathy as well. We got off to a shaky start with homeopathy with some Fourth Organon practitioners who were unable to resolve his issues, but I saw the potential. Somehow I had contacted Dr. Jeff, and met with him in the terminal of a west coast airport to which he had flown in for a seminar, and from there things turned around for us bigtime. Raw helped prolong this guy's life, and homeopathy dealt with issues one after the other. He was my "teacher dog", showing us symptoms and challenging us to deal with them. He had terrible hips, was deaf, incontinent, neutered b/c of prostatic cysts, etc. - and happy My next dog was rawfed from 4 1/2 months on, and the next from 7 weeks. He has had NO shots, NO preventives, etc. ever, and is in glowing health with high titers, at 12. My vets are in full knowledge, and do not question my decisions, given his obvious great health, bless them. There is no question, in my mind, that a varied and appropriate raw diet is the key to continued health and condition. Homeopathy corrects insults, inherited or acquired, but is a tool which best functions in - and is supported by - a properly nourished body.

 

[Dr. Jeff]

Thanks so much Nancy and Ginny for sharing your experiences.

Ginny, I remember meeting you and Tomo at the airport like it was yesterday. I'll be forever grateful to Magda for indirectly connecting us!

 

[GinnyW]

Doggone it, Dr. Jeff! You made me cry

 

[NancyK]

Boy, Nancy; that sounds so much like us! My first dog, born in 1995, was subjected to shots by his breeder, and then my vet, recommended by a friend, started the protocol all over again. He developed orthopedic issues - poor hip development, two cruciate tears, etc. and allergic symptoms, temperament issues, etc. Having heard of raw, I took the plunge and handed him a chicken wing, thinking I had just killed my dog. On from there I became a "mover and shaker" in the northern CA raw movement, and discovered the power of homeopathy as well. We got off to a shaky start with homeopathy with some Fourth Organon practitioners who were unable to resolve his issues, but I saw the potential. Somehow I had contacted Dr. Jeff, and met with him in the terminal of a west coast airport to which he had flown in for a seminar, and from there things turned around for us bigtime. Raw helped prolong this guy's life, and homeopathy dealt with issues one after the other. He was my "teacher dog", showing us symptoms and challenging us to deal with them. He had terrible hips, was deaf, incontinent, neutered b/c of prostatic cysts, etc. - and happy My next dog was rawfed from 4 1/2 months on, and the next from 7 weeks. He has had NO shots, NO preventives, etc. ever, and is in glowing health with high titers, at 12. My vets are in full knowledge, and do not question my decisions, given his obvious great health, bless them. There is no question, in my mind, that a varied and appropriate raw diet is the key to continued health and condition. Homeopathy corrects insults, inherited or acquired, but is a tool which best functions in - and is supported by - a properly nourished body.

Ginny,

What an awesome story! Thanks so much for sharing! I love hearing doggy success stories!

Nancy