So confused as to what to feed Gabby, losing protein from intestine probably. Bile Acid test was normal so her low albumin I assume is from intestinal loss. Will find out more next week. Was told to cook meat for THREE hours at low heat with some squash cubes... I thought cooking food this long KILLS it, my dr. once said it was DEAD food. I also thought the Malliard reaction from cooking food was an issue. She is used to eating raw and gently cooked grass fed meat on top. So now I am supposed to kill the food and feed it to her? Also isn't squash a carb. Her microbiome test said to cut the carbs. The idea is that the overly cooked meat is more digestible. I also want to avoid steroids. The vet said that if her albumin gets lower should probably use steroids. That would cause problems IMO, the reliever of all and curer of none.... I was going to try a plant sterol now that acts like a steroid. Beta Thym by Best for your Pet. Don't know anymore what I am supposed to do with any aspect of her care. I thought a raw diet is species appropriate for dogs but I have heard or read online that cooking has helped some dogs. Throwing up my hands.
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Diet for Protein Losing Enteropathy
- Thread starter LilF
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Oh no, I'm sorry to add any diet confusion.
Fresh food of any kind has a higher vitality level than ultra-processed commercial pet food.
I love your steroid phrase "the reliever of all and curer for none". So true!!
Are the steroid recommendations coming from an internist?
If so, and if you decide to try this short term, be sure to also use a liver protectant like VRS Hepato Tru Benefits or Rx Vitamin's Hepato Support.
Fresh food of any kind has a higher vitality level than ultra-processed commercial pet food.
I love your steroid phrase "the reliever of all and curer for none". So true!!
Are the steroid recommendations coming from an internist?
If so, and if you decide to try this short term, be sure to also use a liver protectant like VRS Hepato Tru Benefits or Rx Vitamin's Hepato Support.
I am just thinking ahead as to what the internal medicine doctor might recommend next thursday depending on her albumin level and ultrasound. I don't want to lose her if the albumin goes too low. I need a natural counterpart to a steroid to get the level down. I was reading that a natural plant sterol could be compounded as well but none of my vets told me about that. So was just projecting ahead. I was reading that cooked food is more easily absorbed than raw which she has eaten all her life. Just cooked a squash on low heat for FIVE hours in the oven... So would you say raw is ok. Cooking is not my thing. She went for an hour and a half walk today in the park and loved loved loved it, smiles from here to the moon.. As I watched her I was thinking I do not want to mess up that quality of life with a steroid. Looking for a counterpart that acts like a steroid but is natural. Started to give her Best for your Pet Beta Thym... It is funny how many different opinions are out there. I am giving her seacure which is a powder of super absorbable protein from white fish and the glutamine and eggs of course. I had to cook those because I think the white was making her sick
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It's super smart to think ahead regarding your internist visit or any other way that we try to help our pets. 
Yes, there are plant sterols used in place of steroids. However, they may not work well for you and can be hard to find. @dr_ judy herman may have a more reliable veterinary source.
Raw is the highest vitality/energy food there is but may not work well for her if she doesn't tolerate it.
I agree about quality of life, and that's why it's important to evaluate BEAM every day after starting any new symptom.
Yes, there are plant sterols used in place of steroids. However, they may not work well for you and can be hard to find. @dr_ judy herman may have a more reliable veterinary source.
Raw is the highest vitality/energy food there is but may not work well for her if she doesn't tolerate it.
I agree about quality of life, and that's why it's important to evaluate BEAM every day after starting any new symptom.
Just got back some results on Gabby.. Folate and Cobalamin were ok (although she got a B12 shot a few days before the test) Her B12 was slightly elevated probably for that reason. BUT, her TLI was ELEVATED. Not thinking she has pancreatitis or malnutrition. Since her SDMA was right at the normal mark 14 (range is 0-14) maybe she has early kidney disease? Can anyone elucidate the high TLI score. I can attach the actual report when I get it but cannot seem to understand how her Total Protein and ALbumin can be low based on any of the above...Thank You for any insight an all your helpful thoughts
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Ah, it sounds like she may have some chronic pancreatic inflammation.
She may have fluid shifts internally driving her numbers down, or she may just be losing protein/albumin when she vomits or in her stool.
Regardless, I'd expect her BEAM to be pretty good with these numbers. As you work on her cellular energy and healing, her TLI should decrease and her albumin should increase.
Please share the exact TLI value when you know it and in the meantime focus on her happy sniffing.?
She may have fluid shifts internally driving her numbers down, or she may just be losing protein/albumin when she vomits or in her stool.
Regardless, I'd expect her BEAM to be pretty good with these numbers. As you work on her cellular energy and healing, her TLI should decrease and her albumin should increase.
Please share the exact TLI value when you know it and in the meantime focus on her happy sniffing.?
Hi Dr. Jeff
Just received the report. Her B12 might be elevated because she got the B12 shot 4 days earlier. Maybe I should stop those when she goes in for acupuncture. So I am not sure what this means. She hasn't vomited as much as her numbers of Albumin and Protein have declined over the past few months. Her urine protein creatinine ratio test was normal in October so doesn't that rule out kidney disease? Could her pancreas be causing the low albumin? I was giving her Pancreatrophin PMG (standard process) several days a week.. Anyway here is her report. Thanks!
Just received the report. Her B12 might be elevated because she got the B12 shot 4 days earlier. Maybe I should stop those when she goes in for acupuncture. So I am not sure what this means. She hasn't vomited as much as her numbers of Albumin and Protein have declined over the past few months. Her urine protein creatinine ratio test was normal in October so doesn't that rule out kidney disease? Could her pancreas be causing the low albumin? I was giving her Pancreatrophin PMG (standard process) several days a week.. Anyway here is her report. Thanks!
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Yes, the low albumin could have an association with chronic pancreatitis. However, the normal Spec CPL test makes this less likely. So this is still somewhat of a physiologic mystery (at least to me).
I'll be researching more about the association of album and the pancreas this weekend.
However, the physiology and diagnosis is not as important as what you can safely and effectively do using energy management methods.
We've talked about them throughout the forum, so I won't rewrite them in this post. Feel free to ask if you have any questions.
They are all based on petting, playing and pranayama (sniffing) and TOP talks a bit more about energy-based strategies:
I'll be researching more about the association of album and the pancreas this weekend.
However, the physiology and diagnosis is not as important as what you can safely and effectively do using energy management methods.
We've talked about them throughout the forum, so I won't rewrite them in this post. Feel free to ask if you have any questions.
They are all based on petting, playing and pranayama (sniffing) and TOP talks a bit more about energy-based strategies:
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Hi again, Lil. I was thinking further about pancreatitis/hypoalbuminemia. I wonder if your vet would be wiling to consult with a specialist at the Texas A&M GI lab where they developed the GI panel, or at Idexx?
If not, would you like me to consult with my friend Dr. Forman?
BTW, feline and canine pancreatitis share similar physiologic mechanisms and diagnostics:
If not, would you like me to consult with my friend Dr. Forman?
BTW, feline and canine pancreatitis share similar physiologic mechanisms and diagnostics:
Hi Dr. Jeff, Gabby's case does seem to be a mystery and maybe not typical. If Dr. Forman has any insight into Gabby, Yes, I would appreciate any thoughts I can follow up on.. It would be my lucky day to get Dr. Forman's opinion as well. THANKS
Dr. Jeff, hope they can figure something out from the ultrasound. I don't want a lot of stress for her with other things. Today she did not vomit first thing in the morning but after eating her thyroid pill and some turkey hunks like she always gets, she regurgitated some about 2 hrs later. Saw lip licking so knew she was feeling sick. Then I waited another 1.5 hrs and gave her bone broth and the glutamine she has been getting and she rather quickly regurged that up. Confused if I should even feed her main meal at all and does she have some chronic pancreatitis? I don't think she did the full vomiting with the retching but still produced contents of the stomach. Maybe a more substantial meal (small one) would help but not sure at this point. It is distressing for her and me.
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I'm really sorry to hear about the vomiting/regurg. episodes Lil. 
Have you tried an Answer's Goat's Milk only fast for a few days?
How's her BEAM today despite her other GI symptoms?
Has she had a chance yet to snuffle or have a sniff walk (or two)?
?
Have you tried an Answer's Goat's Milk only fast for a few days?
How's her BEAM today despite her other GI symptoms?
Has she had a chance yet to snuffle or have a sniff walk (or two)?
?Hello Dr. Jeff
Just got back from Gabby's eval. Should I attach the whole thing (ultrasound and bloodwork) here or do you have another email to send it to. Let me know. I have no idea what to feed her even for dinner now! Inflamed intestines. Possibly cancer at her age. Oddly as an aside, the acupuncturist said she had 3 dogs with intestinal cancer....Makes me wonder why..... They suggest a toxic GI prescription diet which I know is unhealthy. I am so lost as to what to do and what to feed. her. Been cooking her meat but it is unbalanced.Cooking the eggs too. Her albumin went up to 1.9 from a 1.5 but again are these variances in machines or whatever? Back to the acupuncturist .She has given Gabby a B12 shot since she started going a year ago. That is when the Albumin and Total protein started declining I think. REason I bring this up is a study showing that cyanocobalomin aggravates IBD and causes a change in the microbiota. Oddly Gabby's AnimalBiome test showed exactly that bacteria that becomes imbalanced. So no more B12 shots in the form of cyanocobalomin. Gabby tested high in B12. If Gabby has intestinal issues shouldn't she have malabsorption? Don't think she has malabsorption. Here is the link to the adverse effect on IBD of cyanocobalamin, which she has been getting. :-(
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
Just got back from Gabby's eval. Should I attach the whole thing (ultrasound and bloodwork) here or do you have another email to send it to. Let me know. I have no idea what to feed her even for dinner now! Inflamed intestines. Possibly cancer at her age. Oddly as an aside, the acupuncturist said she had 3 dogs with intestinal cancer....Makes me wonder why..... They suggest a toxic GI prescription diet which I know is unhealthy. I am so lost as to what to do and what to feed. her. Been cooking her meat but it is unbalanced.Cooking the eggs too. Her albumin went up to 1.9 from a 1.5 but again are these variances in machines or whatever? Back to the acupuncturist .She has given Gabby a B12 shot since she started going a year ago. That is when the Albumin and Total protein started declining I think. REason I bring this up is a study showing that cyanocobalomin aggravates IBD and causes a change in the microbiota. Oddly Gabby's AnimalBiome test showed exactly that bacteria that becomes imbalanced. So no more B12 shots in the form of cyanocobalomin. Gabby tested high in B12. If Gabby has intestinal issues shouldn't she have malabsorption? Don't think she has malabsorption. Here is the link to the adverse effect on IBD of cyanocobalamin, which she has been getting. :-(
Impact of Cyanocobalamin and Methylcobalamin on Inflammatory Bowel Disease and the Intestinal Microbiota Composition - PubMed
Patients with inflammatory bowel disease (IBD) are usually advised to supplement various types of vitamin B<sub>12</sub>, because vitamin B<sub>12</sub> is generally absorbed in the colon. Thus, in the current study, the influence of cyanocobalamin (CNCBL) or methylcobalamin (MECBL) ingestion on...
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
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Hi Lil-
I'm sorry that you feel lost about what to feed Gabby. Sometimes even just letting her fast works well.
Great news about her albumin! That is awe-some and is an indicator of her body's ability to heal!!
Unfortunately, Dr. Forman also felt that cancers like intestinal adenocarcinoma or lymphoma were most likely because of her age. He also said the IBD and a condition called lymphangiectasia were possibilities.
Yes, you can attach the full report here. It will give us important additional context.
Interesting about B12 considering it is commonly used for intestinal dis-eases. Yes, holding off on the B12 injections for now is a good idea.
Yes, imbalance of her microbiome is an important part of her overall balance. Are you using the AnimalBiome poop pills? If not, you may want to add and start rotating through, probiotics like Rx Biotic, Mitomax, Probio Defense and the wonderful probiotic blend in one of the gravies from our friend Anthony at clearconsciencepet.com (HA! members can use the initial order coupon code for a 20% discount = DRJEFFCCPINTRO):
SuperGravy® Bon A’ La Goat™ Dog Food Topper Gravy & Broth Mix
For today and going forward, focus on activating her natural healing mechanisms by doing the things that make her happiest and promote pranayama (breathing). Therapeutic sniff walks often check both boxes.
I'm sorry that you feel lost about what to feed Gabby. Sometimes even just letting her fast works well.
Great news about her albumin! That is awe-some and is an indicator of her body's ability to heal!!
Unfortunately, Dr. Forman also felt that cancers like intestinal adenocarcinoma or lymphoma were most likely because of her age. He also said the IBD and a condition called lymphangiectasia were possibilities.
Yes, you can attach the full report here. It will give us important additional context.
Interesting about B12 considering it is commonly used for intestinal dis-eases. Yes, holding off on the B12 injections for now is a good idea.
Yes, imbalance of her microbiome is an important part of her overall balance. Are you using the AnimalBiome poop pills? If not, you may want to add and start rotating through, probiotics like Rx Biotic, Mitomax, Probio Defense and the wonderful probiotic blend in one of the gravies from our friend Anthony at clearconsciencepet.com (HA! members can use the initial order coupon code for a 20% discount = DRJEFFCCPINTRO):
SuperGravy® Bon A’ La Goat™ Dog Food Topper Gravy & Broth Mix
For today and going forward, focus on activating her natural healing mechanisms by doing the things that make her happiest and promote pranayama (breathing). Therapeutic sniff walks often check both boxes.
Hello Dr. Jeff, Finally getting around to attaching Gabby's workup, bloods, ultrasound. Will not be getting an endoscopy so I will have to work with the info I have. Overall, BEAM has been good. She loves her walks and even wants to go when it is stinking cold here for an hour. Bilious vomiting has decreased as well. Lately has been going about 7-8 days without it. Today though after getting her very small morning meal soon as she wakes up, about an hour later she started regurg and then she drinks water and eventually threw up. Then goes to drink water and throws up the water. I removed the water, gave her some stuff I had mixed up Nux Vomica and Gastruccomeel and things settled down. So last night gave her the Animal Biome fecal probiotic. I was giving her one a day in morning and she did fine but seems this is second time I gave it to her the night before and she didn't feel well next morning. She is supposed to get 4 but not giving her. Not even sure it works and is very expensive. I heard anecdotally from a vet that the test is better than the actual "treatment."Will maybe try some of the products you mention above. Regarding the attached results, seems to me the problem may be in small intestine? The question is if I should deworm her even if the fecal samples were normal. Any other thoughts would be appreciated. Been feeding a lower fat diet with bison meat overly cooked instead of raw. Seems this is not a good thing over time. Top off her meal in morning with some sardines or salmon. Evening meal is bison meat with 2 runny cooked egg whites and one yolk. She doesn't seem to tolerate the uncooked whites but was fine with the raw yolk. Note her albumin went up to 1.9 from a 1.5 and the Total Protein went from a 3.4 to a 3.9 but it was the in house lab at the hospital. Hope it does indicate a true rise in these values.
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Yes, an intestinal problem is most likely.
Wonderful news about her vomiting less and good BEAM.
Yes, 3 days in a row of Panacur deworming is a good idea. Especially considering how benign it is and that it can help many things aside from worms.
Regarding her intestinal tight junctions, and microbiome, this can help:
ionbiome.com
Wonderful news about her vomiting less and good BEAM.
Yes, 3 days in a row of Panacur deworming is a good idea. Especially considering how benign it is and that it can help many things aside from worms.
Regarding her intestinal tight junctions, and microbiome, this can help:
Gut Health Supplement for Dogs & Cats - Gut Support for Pets
ION* Gut Support For Pets seals cells in the gut lining, helping to keep toxins out of your pet's body and strengthening their microbiome diversity.
ionbiome.com
Can this be used in place of the fecal probiotic I was giving her. Seems she gets sick next day if i give it to her for the prior evening meal. So I can use the above as a probiotic. Can I use this along with other probiotics that were previously noted like Probio Defense and Mitomax that I was going to look into. Or should I just pick one thing?
A question on homeopathics--- I mixed up some nux vomica and gastruccomeel about a month ago and put it in the refrigerator. Yesterday I gave some to Gabby when she kept vomiting in the morning and it seemed to work. But when I held it up to the light, it seemed like it had particles floating around--had it gone bad? How long will a remedy last in the refrigerator? I hate to throw it out. The weather here has been cold, very cold and snowy salty surfaces. It is difficult to "enjoy" a walk. I take Gabby out but it is hard to keep up her BEAM when there is no break from the upper teens and lower twenties. I hope she holds up. She is deaf. I used to play indoor games but now she cannot hear cues. It is a frustrating time.
A question on homeopathics--- I mixed up some nux vomica and gastruccomeel about a month ago and put it in the refrigerator. Yesterday I gave some to Gabby when she kept vomiting in the morning and it seemed to work. But when I held it up to the light, it seemed like it had particles floating around--had it gone bad? How long will a remedy last in the refrigerator? I hate to throw it out. The weather here has been cold, very cold and snowy salty surfaces. It is difficult to "enjoy" a walk. I take Gabby out but it is hard to keep up her BEAM when there is no break from the upper teens and lower twenties. I hope she holds up. She is deaf. I used to play indoor games but now she cannot hear cues. It is a frustrating time.
Dr. Jeff
My acupunturist mentioned Panacur, but for 6 days and I cannot seem to find it. Does it require a RX? Is the worming for 3 or 6 days? I then forgot to mention my vet sent Gabby's stool out and they did not find an antigen for any worms. So would it be safe to say she doesn't need the de worming?
My acupunturist mentioned Panacur, but for 6 days and I cannot seem to find it. Does it require a RX? Is the worming for 3 or 6 days? I then forgot to mention my vet sent Gabby's stool out and they did not find an antigen for any worms. So would it be safe to say she doesn't need the de worming?
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